Runamokk (Swingfly) Guild Soul Eater and some others?

Duos-Bandaid wrote:

Hikushiru wrote:
SO again cut the crap and quit making up excuses to justify these people breaking the rules.
Let's toss the rules out the window and allow people to do whatever they want in /a.

I won't address issues about Persona in this thread and I've already stated that I agree Soul Eater's members were in the wrong in how they responded. So yea, all this time I've been saying I agree with that part of your argument. I'm saying that the initial response to Swing was also wrong and that is a fact people seem to be overlooking. 

Now I will address this issue of the attitude you're taking with me. Just because my opinion and my views differ from yours, that does not invalidate them and it certainly does not call for you to talk to me in that manner. I don't talk to people like that and I certainly don't tolerate people talking to me that way. State your opinions and why you think you're right. I'll read them and I'll be civil regardless of whether or not I agree. I expect that common courtesy to be returned.

Taking attitude with you? no one here has any attitude towards you.

The initial response to swingfly was not wrong. Read the screenshots again and tell where you see anyone responding to swingfly in a way they should not have.
In fact it was swingfly who 1 minute after trying to enforce the rules, before anyone could say anything else started to spam the chat ( breaking the same rule )
Now you expect others to listen to you about the rules when you are spamming it in chat?

you are coming here with alot of bs trying to justify these guys breaking the rules, then you say you agree they broke the rules.
You agree but you keep trying to justify it?

I am saying that both parties involved are at fault. Honestly is that so difficult? And that's what I've been saying over and over again because no one seems to want to acknowledge both sides of the issue.

The portal part of that chat is a non issue for me. When I first read this thread I didn't even give it any importance. It all happened within one to two minutes and there were multiple people involved including non soul eater members. From what I can tell a soul eater member initially asked for the portal position. His guild leader and other guild members seemed to be teasing him leaving him exasperated and making that smiley. Someone tried to be funny. Persona put his comment at the end of it. All of that lasted within in two minutes and hardly significant. Is it somewhere in the rules that a leader can't remind someone of the rules and then right after tease her own guildy or joke around in /a?

People have side conversations in /a all the time about sports teams and models and anime and what ever other interests they have. These convos go on for about 20 to 30 minutes, sometimes even longer with the same people being involved. This situation seems more like a small side conversation that people decided to latch on and make a big deal out of. Honestly the only issue I see is towards the end of the conversation with the Soul Eater members. 

As for saying the initial response to swing was wrong, I stand by that. She said not to spam /a with trade messages because the same message was given twice within less than 7 minutes. I tend to agree with that view of what's spam and what's not. The person involved started arguing against that. That's is what I view as the very start of the problem and that is what I think is important to stress.

As for attitude against me, there's a difference between how you say things. You can say "I don't agree with what you're saying" and that's perfectly fine but to dismiss someone's arguments with "cut the crap" after being specifically asked not to take that attitude certainly counts as attitude in my eyes. I took the time to read these threads and took time to think about it before I posted and then took time to actually write up what I thought about it. If I honestly didn't think my arguments were valid I wouldn't have bothered so I don't appreciate blanket statement dismissals in that kind of language and attitude.

Duos-Bandaid wrote:I am saying that both parties involved are at fault. Honestly is that so difficult? And that's what I've been saying over and over again because no one seems to want to acknowledge both sides of the issue.

The portal part of that chat is a non issue for me. When I first read this thread I didn't even give it any importance. It all happened within one to two minutes and there were multiple people involved including non soul eater members. From what I can tell a soul eater member initially asked for the portal position. His guild leader and other guild members seemed to be teasing him leaving him exasperated and making that smiley. Someone tried to be funny. Persona put his comment at the end of it. All of that lasted within in two minutes and hardly significant. Is it somewhere in the rules that a leader can't remind someone of the rules and then right after tease her own guildy or joke around in /a?

People have side conversations in /a all the time about sports teams and models and anime and what ever other interests they have. These convos go on for about 20 to 30 minutes, sometimes even longer with the same people being involved. This situation seems more like a small side conversation that people decided to latch on and make a big deal out of. Honestly the only issue I see is towards the end of the conversation with the Soul Eater members. 

As for saying the initial response to swing was wrong, I stand by that. She said not to spam /a with trade messages because the same message was given twice within less than 7 minutes. I tend to agree with that view of what's spam and what's not. The person involved started arguing against that. That's is what I view as the very start of the problem and that is what I think is important to stress.

As for attitude against me, there's a difference between how you say things. You can say "I don't agree with what you're saying" and that's perfectly fine but to dismiss someone's arguments with "cut the crap" after being specifically asked not to take that attitude certainly counts as attitude in my eyes. I took the time to read these threads and took time to think about it before I posted and then took time to actually write up what I thought about it. If I honestly didn't think my arguments were valid I wouldn't have bothered so I don't appreciate blanket statement dismissals in that kind of language and attitude.

The portal comment which caused the uproar in the first place is a non issue?
Haha right ok.
The whole thing started when swingfly decided to spam portal In /a to " enforce " the rules.
Also her comment " please report me" shows exactly what she thinks will happen if she purposely breaks the rules, absolutely nothing. And that is exactly the action that has been taken.

It was swingfly by her actions that encouraged her guildmates and the others to continue with this and caused the huge problem that we have now.

Not once in those screenshots did swingfly ever try to calm and stop even her guild members from escalating the situation, what she did was join them which assured them it was ok because nothing could be done to them.
I guess in aeon if you belong to certain guilds no action can be taken against you no matter what you do.

By all means let us continue to punish those who break the little rules and let guild leaders encourage there members to break the rules.

Once again, this was the first complaint thread on Swingfly and Soul Eater members. Some people might have had a bad impression of them for a long time, but they did not make their reasons known on the forum.

There has also been a debate on how things that happened before the screenshots were taken might have affected their behavior. That does not justify what they did, but due to these and other factors I will decide based on how Swingfly will reply next and whether Soul Eater members continue this kind of behavior.

Now please stop with the distracting comments, and let Swingfly reply, unless you have new evidence of Soul Eater members breaking rules.

Pirate-Bay wrote:Once again, this was the first complaint thread on Swingfly and Soul Eater members. Some people might have had a bad impression of them for a long time, but they did not make their reasons known on the forum.

There has also been a debate on how things that happened before the screenshots were taken might have affected their behavior. That does not justify what they did, but due to these and other factors I will decide based on how Swingfly will reply next and whether Soul Eater members continue this kind of behavior.

Now please stop with the distracting comments, and let Swingfly reply, unless you have new evidence of Soul Eater members breaking rules.

There has been more than time for swingfly to reply
One of the first comments in this thread belongs to swingfly where she stated everything is 100% accurate.
That was already her answer to the report made against her, she made her comment and left the ball in your court.

My comments are not distracting, they are the truth and you know it. The whole point is you are doing exactly what shed knew you would which is nothing.

I believe I've been mistreated in reaction to my comment to Natureboy's spamming. 
I feel offended especially by Hikushiru's unfounded behaviour towards me. As for my members I do not think they reacted the way they should have done it. I will surely have a talk with the most active ones. That is everything from my side. 
^ Hiku, not everyone has so much time on their hand as you may think. I've been busy irl, thus long response time. Next time refrain from commenting if you do not have any knowledge of the truth.

Swingfly I personal asked you to take it to PM, because it was a matter of one person, you were talking to, you complained about spamming, because of a repeated question 6 minutes later. And even after my polite request to take it to PM you continued to use the /a chat.

I also PM'd Natureboy, explaining that asking twice is also spamming, although I agreed there was no 10 second, but 6 minutes. It was still a short time, because I had reactions on questions or help even 15 minutes after I asked the question. 

Natureboy said thanks and after that moment everything could have cooled down. Only you continued in /a chat after that. Where Natureboy felt the need to also defend himself, because of the false acusation I can understand that.

So the reason why I reported is you spammed the /a with spamming accusations of another person. After friendly request you ignore that and then you even asked to be reported. You are a Guil Leader, you should be an example to other, because when leaders misbehave, followers will misbehave. Even when it is not on the same subject, you said an example that it is okey to disregard the rules we have for a very good reason.

What I would like to see from you is intention of following the rules by yourself and set an example to others. Warn people in /a chat polite, give link to the rules if they continue send a PM If the continue, report and have print screens. Thats should be all to it. That should go for everyone any other discussion about a person breaking rules should not be in /a.

I do not consider your request to have been polite at any time.

(Alliance) Sterredag: first nature asking twice is also spaming... second everybody else, you can pm in stead of discuss it here pls
(Alliance) Swingfly: Its an alliance matter so it can be discussed on /a chat.
to Swingfly : no its a personal matter, so take it private pls

I see nothing impolite about this request. If your standards for politeness exceed what Sterredag has shown here, then I believe you are guilty of breaking your own etiquette standards.

[00:15] (Alliance) Sterredag: guys pls discuss this in PM
[00:16] (Alliance) Swingfly: Its an alliance matter so it can be discussed on /a chat.
[00:16] to Swingfly : no its a personal matter, so take it private pls
[00:17] from Swingfly: its not a personal matter, if you think differently go ahead and report this matter to Pirate bay or chat moderators.

Please you really would have to explain to me what possibly is impolite about this?


edit --> didnt see the previous reply, thanx for that

The thing that you ignored the fact that I was discussing an alliance matter on appropriate channel. It is also my last comment, I do not find it necessary to continue on talking with you any further. Cheers.

Swingfly wrote:I believe I've been mistreated in reaction to my comment to Natureboy's spamming. 
I feel offended especially by Hikushiru's unfounded behaviour towards me. As for my members I do not think they reacted the way they should have done it. I will surely have a talk with the most active ones. That is everything from my side. 
^ Hiku, not everyone has so much time on their hand as you may think. I've been busy irl, thus long response time. Next time refrain from commenting if you do not have any knowledge of the truth.

I know what the truth is, so don't say I don't.
The truth is you never once tried to stop your members when they started with the spams and insults in /a. Instead you encouraged them by participating in it.

You Sir are saying some serious bullshit  but I guess you know what happened in Soul Eater better than I do, Apologies for being a leader here and knowing what exactly is going on.

Swingfly wrote:You Sir are saying some serious bullshit  but I guess you know what happened in Soul Eater better than I do, Apologies for being a leader here and knowing what exactly is going on.

This carried on for over 30 minutes, if you say you were talking to them trying to get them to stop in guild chat and they chose not to listen why not mute them?
You carried on with them in alliance chat. Actions speak louder than words and your actions show just how much you didn't try and stop your guild members.

Swingfly wrote:The thing that you ignored the fact that I was discussing an alliance matter on appropriate channel. It is also my last comment, I do not find it necessary to continue on talking with you any further. Cheers.

So I'm impolite because I disagree? strange. I still believe if ONE person missbehaves it is NOT an alliance matter, but a personal matter. personal to the person that missbehaves. If there is discussion about that from one person to another about this rule, that should go in PM, not in /a chat. 

Rules of the alliance are: we dont discuss the rules in /a chat, we can do that on the forum AND not having a long conversation between two people, what this actually was, because other people who said something did not about the subject what spamming was. Or what you did/said, or what nature did/said.

Hikushiru wrote:
The portal comment which caused the uproar in the first place is a non issue?
Haha right ok.
The whole thing started when swingfly decided to spam portal In /a to " enforce " the rules.
Also her comment " please report me" shows exactly what she thinks will happen if she purposely breaks the rules, absolutely nothing. And that is exactly the action that has been taken.

I already explained what I thought of the portal conversation based on the chat logs. I broke it down as I saw it.

Our views on this part seems to be where we mainly disagree both for this issue and on the one regarding Persona. 

I don't think the portal thing was directed towards Natureboy at all and I don't see why people interpreted it that way. 

The please report me shows that she does not think she did anything wrong. She believed that she was right in distinguishing it as a matter to be discussed on /a. Honestly that is the part that I agree with. I believe there is a distinction to be made about clarifying a rule in /a and arguing about a rule in /a. A conversation that goes along the lines of Is this against the rules? Yes it is, What, why? This is why... would be what I class as clarifying and I feel very strongly that is appropriate in /a because everyone can see it and it reinforces the original rule and expounds on it. A conversation that goes is this is against the rules? Yes it is. What, that's a dumb rule, why do we have that rule? A matter like that is what I would call an argument about the rules. That is when you say if you have issues with the alliance rules lets take it out of /a and talk to either a chat mod or your guild leader or something like that.

Pirate takes action as needed and he does not play favorites. He has no reason to.

As for sterrdag's request, sterredag is always polite although as I said before I do not believe there was a need per se to take it to pm.

I believe Swing has taken appropriate action towards the part of the conversation where Soul Eater was at fault and only time will tell the rest.

Duos-Bandaid wrote:

Hikushiru wrote:
The portal comment which caused the uproar in the first place is a non issue?
Haha right ok.
The whole thing started when swingfly decided to spam portal In /a to " enforce " the rules.
Also her comment " please report me" shows exactly what she thinks will happen if she purposely breaks the rules, absolutely nothing. And that is exactly the action that has been taken.

I already explained what I thought of the portal conversation based on the chat logs. I broke it down as I saw it.

Our views on this part seems to be where we mainly disagree both for this issue and on the one regarding Persona. 

I don't think the portal thing was directed towards Natureboy at all and I don't see why people interpreted it that way. 

The please report me shows that she does not think she did anything wrong. She believed that she was right in distinguishing it as a matter to be discussed on /a. Honestly that is the part that I agree with. I believe there is a distinction to be made about clarifying a rule in /a and arguing about a rule in /a. A conversation that goes along the lines of Is this against the rules? Yes it is, What, why? This is why... would be what I class as clarifying and I feel very strongly that is appropriate in /a because everyone can see it and it reinforces the original rule and expounds on it. A conversation that goes is this is against the rules? Yes it is. What, that's a dumb rule, why do we have that rule? A matter like that is what I would call an argument about the rules. That is when you say if you have issues with the alliance rules lets take it out of /a and talk to either a chat mod or your guild leader or something like that.

Pirate takes action as needed and he does not play favorites. He has no reason to.

As for sterrdag's request, sterredag is always polite although as I said before I do not believe there was a need per se to take it to pm.

I believe Swing has taken appropriate action towards the part of the conversation where Soul Eater was at fault and only time will tell the rest.

The portal part of the screenshot shows swingfly breaking the same rule she had just told some one else to not to break. She also said respect the rules or leave.
Where was her respect for the rules hmm?

Markthefeca also made a comment " suck my penis " at which point swingfly then told another alliance member in /a to report her or refer to marks post. That was just disrespectful and rude.

She said nothing in her posts here regarding her behaviour rather all she said was that she would speak with her guildies.which to me seems like she does not think anything she said to alliance members in /a was wrong.
Also wasn't swingfly thethe one who left aeon before because someone responded to her harshly?
Yet this is the respect as a guild leader that she shows to others.

Btw she was wrong about the timing between natures posts, and that us where all this nonsense began

I just want to add that the reason I believe it should be taken to PM was not the small talk about what is a rule. But about the fact Swingfly stated that Natureboy was spamming because of an interval of 10 seconds, then natureboy (correctly) defending it was 6 minutes. Swingfly did NOT explain why it was spamming, only stated it was spam. Natureboy asked for an explanation, but Swingfly did not explain.

Within that Swingfly did spam himself. Making his own statement untrustable.

It was me who explained that asking twice indeed is spam. Although I wouldnt say anything with an inverval of 6 minutes, the first time, I would if that would repeat. After this explanation Swingfly continued the argument about the 10 seconds (that was not a correct statement) and Natureboy defending it in /a because it was stated in /a That is why I asked to discuss in PM.

If only Swingfly would have explained, then I would think it was an alliance matter, because everybody learns the rules then. And that is why I always first reply in /a chat. You may disagree about this vision of course  this is just why I believed it was not an alliance matter anymore.

Sorry to break it to you but you seem to have some serious mental problems. Its just a game and yet you spend hours here discussing a matter I don't care about. My advice: get over it. Its not like you make the alliance any better by making a fuss out of it on forum. What you achieve though is a bunch of people being more and more angry with each other just because you chose to instigate the currently heated discussion. 
It is because people like you and Hikushiru, who decide to defend the GUILTY, that many alliance members (that is WCiP, SE to say the least) feel alienated. I also take the option of you trying to ruin AEON into consideration, since you weaken already weak bonds between us. 

Concerning the "nonsense" of Natureboy's spamming, does it make his misdeed any less troublesome? The deed is the same, he kept on spamming the alliance chat, and that isn't only the day the argument started, he was able to go on with these spamming sessions of his for hours, repeating the same question over and over again despite there being no response. 

Now moving on to me leaving Aeon leaving the alliance last time I was offended. It was truly the case, and one of conditions of me coming back was the correction of Nox's behaviour towards me and my guild members. So on these grounds I could demand an apology to say the least, which I don't anyway since its the same instigating I accused the leader of Rage guild of. 

Just a food for thought. If you defend a guilty person and you turn against the one who defends the commonly accepted rights, who are you to instruct me? I for one will surely no longer tolerate such an aggressive behaviour towards me and any of my friends. 
It is also the last response you receive from me, I plan not to spend a second more on explaining myself which I consider an idiocy. Hopefully the content of this message will shed some light on your doubts.

Swingfly wrote:Sorry to break it to you but you seem to have some serious mental problems. Its just a game and yet you spend hours here discussing a matter I don't care about. My advice: get over it. Its not like you make the alliance any better by making a fuss out of it on forum. What you achieve though is a bunch of people being more and more angry with each other just because you chose to instigate the currently heated discussion. 
It is because people like you and Hikushiru, who decide to defend the GUILTY, that many alliance members (that is WCiP, SE to say the least) feel alienated. I also take the option of you trying to ruin AEON into consideration, since you weaken already weak bonds between us. 

Concerning the "nonsense" of Natureboy's spamming, does it make his misdeed any less troublesome? The deed is the same, he kept on spamming the alliance chat, and that isn't only the day the argument started, he was able to go on with these spamming sessions of his for hours, repeating the same question over and over again despite there being no response. 

Now moving on to me leaving Aeon leaving the alliance last time I was offended. It was truly the case, and one of conditions of me coming back was the correction of Nox's behaviour towards me and my guild members. So on these grounds I could demand an apology to say the least, which I don't anyway since its the same instigating I accused the leader of Rage guild of. 

Just a food for thought. If you defend a guilty person and you turn against the one who defends the commonly accepted rights, who are you to instruct me? I for one will surely no longer tolerate such an aggressive behaviour towards me and any of my friends. 
It is also the last response you receive from me, I plan not to spend a second more on explaining myself which I consider an idiocy. Hopefully the content of this message will shed some light on your doubts.

Saying steredrag and I and trying to ruin aeon by defending the guilty when in fact you are the one trying to ruin aeon.
Fact is neither of us have ever broken any Aeon rules, yet you and your guild members pretty much broke them all at once.
You broke 3 rules at the same time and now you say you don't care about that matter?

Nature boy wasn't guilty he posted within 6 minutes of his first post, and you attacked him for it.
Who are you to instruct some one on the rules when you broke so many of them at the same time?
You have a serious superiority complex, your blatant disregard for the rules and your disrespect towards everyone in AEON will be what destroys aeon.

Swingfly wrote:Sorry to break it to you but you seem to have some serious mental problems.

And you accuse me of being rude? and impolite?

I didn't defend nature anyway, I did pm'd him and explain it to him. Because I do not defend the guilty one that also means I would not defend you in this matter.

You are stating yourself you dont care about this matter, so you dont care about a correct behaviour towards people who do not follow rules? Hikushiru is a chat moderator he is a better person to judge this matter then you or me for that fact.

I am allowed to explain my actions, if that in your opinion will brake Aeon apart, i cant fix that for you.

But I believe your behaviour about acusing others and then dont follow up on your own statements, together with really getting insulting (see quote above) I guess I should be the one asking for an appoligy ( something I never have done before, and dont see any reason to start now, because I dont need fake appoligies )

Thats all.